[cc-community] using Creative Commons as a fig leave
zotz at 100jamz.com
Fri Jul 10 10:44:11 EDT 2009
Perhaps one thought would be to have two "lines" at least going on:
One where is just the BY-SA license and no further grants.
Another where there is the BY-SA license and the extra grants.
Make it clear that the artists get a stated "non-shrinkable" percentage of all
Tribe of Noise income or perhaps two different percentages depending on
whether the income comes from the BY-SA or the extra grants or perhaps
depending on whether the artist or tune is a BY-SA only or extra grant tune.
One reason for the BY-SA only license option is that it will allow for a wider
remix culture option for the Tribe of Noise artists. They will be able to
upload songs containing BY-SA works from non Tribe of Noise artists.
Do you currently share a percentage of revenue with your artists and do your
legal agreements require this or could you not share it?
all the best,
On Friday 10 July 2009 07:24:08 Paul Keller wrote:
> here is the reply from my blog (hessel also posted this as a comment
> you are right about the attribution part, my oversight, i have
> corrected it in the main text.
> also happy to hear that you are considering revising the way you
> provide information (my suggestion is that you also inform users about
> which rights they grant to ToN and how you intend to use them in the
> upload ageement). I also think that it is a good thing that you
> consider revising the wording in the first part of section 9.1 of the
> let me know when you make these changes and i will post that on my blog.
> best, paul
> On 10 Jul 2009, at 12:41, Hessel van Oorschot wrote:
> > In reaction to Paul’s article ‘using CC as a fig leaf’:
> > •
> > Tribe of Noise is off course aware of the synchronization problem as
> > described by Paul. This is why Tribe of Noise developed a format to
> > use CC+ licenses. CC+ is THE solution for this synch problem and a
> > reasonable way how an artist can be reimbursed, which some of the
> > Tribe of Noise artists already experienced.
> > •
> > Paul describes how the use of section 9 § 1 of the Tribe of Noise
> > whatever they want with the uploaded works without giving the artist
> > a reasonable fee for this use.
> > The problem of not giving a fee to the original author/artist
> > actually also counts for the CC-BY-SA license, but is this not one
> > of the main characteristics of the license? This is why Tribe of
> > Noise uses CC+ licenses.
> > Nevertheless there are still possibilities to earn money with or
> > without a CC-license for the author/artist. Besides this the main
> > reason to upload on Tribe of Noise could be to become well known, to
> > enlarge the network of the author/artist and to a have stronger
> > negotiating power for their future repertoire.
> > Paul’s statement about the possibility for Tribe of Noise to sub
> > license without giving attribution is not accurate. Dutch law
> > third parties need to attribute if they are using an original work.
> > A Dutch author has moral rights, which always give the right to
> > attribution to his work, except when he waives this right. Such a
> > to attribution is one of the moral rights which prevent third
> > parties from doing whatever they want with original works.
> > The suggestion of misusing section 9, is an hasty assumption and in
> > reality has never happened. Section 9 is created to give Tribe of
> > Noise more freedom to use the uploaded works to improve their
> > services and their website, as stated in the article. Maybe the term
> > ‘business operations’ can be interpreted in several ways and
> > deserves some clarification. Tribe of Noise is always open to
> > improvement.
> > •
> > Finally Paul's arguments seem to be based on the fact that he did
> > not get fully exposed to all the info/only partially explored all
> > available information, updates etc. that are provided to members.
> > If this means Tribe of Noise needs to clarify some of it's choices
> > we are happy to oblige.
> > Although we do not get a lot of legal questions surrounding the used
> > licenses, the ones we get are always answered extensively. Artists
> > that are uncomfortable with CC or are for example BUMA members are
> > still invited as member without uploading any music. This way they
> > can still engage with their fellow musicians around the globe and
> > just check out what Tribe of Noise is about.
> > <hessel.vcf>_______________________________________________
> > cc-community mailing list
> > cc-community at lists.ibiblio.org
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-community
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