[cc-community] US Federal sites claiming copyright restrictions

Jon Phillips jon at creativecommons.org
Tue Feb 12 07:43:51 EST 2008


It would be a great service to keep track of those you have
contacted...if you noticed the Creative Commons blog today, CC is
invested in this freeing, or rather notification of freed data through
http://public.resource.org

I have more to talk with you about too...another thread :)

Jon


On Tue, 2008-02-12 at 23:35 +1100, Chris Watkins wrote:
> Thanks Jon, 
> 
> Actually, contacting them is my next step. I just wanted to check
> first if there were any insights on this, anything I'd missed. Glad to
> hear you've had good results. 
> 
> I did contact Pacific Northwest National Laboratory a while back, as I
> couldn't see a permissions notice on the site. I was told "we are no
> direct employees of the government. Each employee is a contractor with
> Battelle." So, based on
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_of_the_United_States_Government#Works_produced_by_contractors it seems like their work is *not* public domain. But that's just one site - many more still to try. 
> 
> Chris
> 
> On Feb 12, 2008 7:39 PM, Jon Phillips <jon at creativecommons.org> wrote:
>         Chris, have you tried to contact them about this? I've taken
>         pretty bold
>         steps on contacting these orgs in the past and had great
>         results...
>         
>         Regardless, I'm happy to see more movement in this area of
>         data mining
>         public data...
>         
>         Jon
>         
>         
>         On Mon, 2008-02-11 at 19:50 -0600, Rich Vázquez wrote:
>         > I absolutely agree with the "shoulds"  of the tone and that
>         they
>         > should be more explicit to encourage the fact that it's open
>         for
>         > usage.  Frankly, I think this is influenced by:
>         > 1) The tone of the agency, and as we know some people have
>         been
>         > stationed in agencies even though they have argued against
>         what they
>         > stand for.  Those who want to spread their mission the most
>         tend to be
>         > the most open.
>         > 2) Possibly the tone of the person doing the actual content
>         deployment
>         > and the hyper attitude towards copyright some webmaster and
>         designers
>         > tend to have at times.
>         >
>         > It would be nice if along with requiring public domain
>         access an
>         > explicit statement of access and openness was required as
>         well.
>         >
>         > I think the VistaWeb system
>         (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VistA_Web)
>         > was originally released due to lawsuit or FOIA request, but
>         once it
>         > was out it flourished.  I think the owners didn't mind, but
>         the lack
>         > of openness in their worldview was enough to hinder it for
>         quite some
>         > time.
>         >
>         > On Feb 11, 2008 5:37 PM, Chris Watkins
>         <chriswaterguy at appropedia.org>
>         > wrote:
>         >         On Feb 12, 2008 10:19 AM, Rich Vázquez
>         >         <rich.vazquez at gmail.com> wrote:
>         >
>         >                 I believe the TVA statements protects the
>         public  from
>         >                 publishing or acting under the guise of TVA.
>         >
>         >         For the trademarks, logos and service marks, that's
>         fair
>         >         enough, but the vague reference to copyrighted
>         material gives
>         >         the impression that anything on the site shouldn't
>         be touched,
>         >         without actually saying so.
>         >
>         >
>         >                 Some government agencies produce web sites
>         with works
>         >                 created by others, especially images.
>          Rights to
>         >                 photographs, etc. might  be donated or
>         purchased from
>         >                 individuals or non-profits which retain
>         rights to the
>         >                 works.
>         >
>         >         Yes - but other US federal sites I've seen deal with
>         this in a
>         >         much more open way - they have a clear statement to
>         the effect
>         >         that everything is public domain unless it's marked
>         as
>         >         copyright. E.g. http://www.usaid.gov/faqs.html#q15 -
>         "Unless a
>         >         copyright is indicated, information on this Web site
>         is in the
>         >         public domain and may be reproduced, published or
>         otherwise
>         >         used without USAID's permission."
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >                 --
>         >                 --
>         >                 Rich Vázquez
>         >
>         >
>         >                 On Feb 11, 2008 5:14 PM, Chris Watkins
>         >                 <chriswaterguy at appropedia.org> wrote:
>         >
>         >
>         >                         Can anyone lend some insight or
>         legal
>         >                         perspectives into sites such as the
>         following
>         >                         two, which claim copyright even
>         though they're
>         >                         US  federal sites - an agency in one
>         case, a
>         >                         federally owned corporation in the
>         other.
>         >
>         >                         The EPA.gov site, which is federal
>         and should
>         >                         be public domain (assuming it's the
>         work of
>         >                         federal employee), states that
>         "Commercial use
>         >                         of the documents available from this
>         server
>         >                         may be protected under the U.S. and
>         Foreign
>         >                         Copyright Laws". This is worded very
>         vaguely,
>         >                         but I assume the only way it could
>         make sense
>         >                         is if a third party held the
>         copyright - in
>         >                         which case the permission to
>         distribute or
>         >                         copy doesn't make sense. The full
>         statement
>         >                         is:
>         >
>         >                         "Information presented on this WWW
>         site is
>         >                         considered public information and
>         may be
>         >                         distributed or copied. The U.S.
>         Government
>         >                         retains a nonexclusive, royalty-free
>         license
>         >                         to publish or reproduce these
>         documents, or
>         >                         allow others to do so, for U.S.
>         Government
>         >                         purposes. These documents may be
>         freely
>         >                         distributed and used for
>         non-commercial,
>         >                         scientific and educational purposes.
>         >                         Commercial use of the documents
>         available from
>         >                         this server may be protected under
>         the U.S.
>         >                         and Foreign Copyright Laws.
>         Individual
>         >                         documents on this server may have
>         different
>         >                         copyright conditions, and that will
>         be noted
>         >                         in those documents."
>         >
>         >
>         >                         (This is for a regional sub-website
>         of the
>         >                         EPA, as I could find no statement
>         for the site
>         >                         as a whole. But I think the same
>         principle
>         >                         applies.)
>         >
>         >                         Another confusing site is tva.gov -
>         although
>         >                         TVA is a federally owned
>         corporation, the
>         >                         notice at
>         http://www.tva.gov/disclaim.htm
>         >                         states: 'All trademarks, logos,
>         service marks,
>         >                         and copyrighted material contained
>         on this Web
>         >                         site ("marks") are the property of
>         TVA'. (A
>         >                         bit unclear - they don't specify
>         what material
>         >                         actually is copyright, and no
>         copyright
>         >                         notices were found, in a brief
>         browse. )
>         >
>         >                         Both TVA and EPA have content we'd
>         love to use
>         >                         on Appropedia (about sustainability
>         and
>         >                         renewable energy) but obviously we
>         can't do so
>         >                         if there's any uncertainty about
>         whether it's
>         >                         public domain.
>         >
>         >                         Chris
>         >
>         >                         --
>         >                         Chris Watkins  (a.k.a.
>         Chriswaterguy)
>         >
>         >                         Founding admin at Appropedia.org,
>         the wiki of:
>         >                                             - International
>         >                         development
>         >                                             - Anti-poverty
>         strategies
>         >                                             - Sustainability
>         >                                             - Appropriate
>         technology
>         >                                             - Collaboration
>         for
>         >                         practical solutions
>         >
>         >                         Founding director, Appropedia
>         Foundation,
>         >                         501(c)(3)
>         >
>         >                         Buy online through
>         >                         http://appropedia.maatiam.com
>         (Amazon, eBay
>         >                         and more) and a percentage of your
>         purchase
>         >                         goes to Appropedia - at no extra
>         cost to you.
>         >
>         >                         The economy is a wholly owned
>         subsidiary of
>         >                         the environment. - Tim Wirth
>         >
>         >
>         _______________________________________________
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>         >
>         http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-community
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
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>         >
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>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >         --
>         >         Chris Watkins  (a.k.a. Chriswaterguy)
>         >
>         >         Founding admin at Appropedia.org, the wiki of:
>         >                             - International development
>         >                             - Anti-poverty strategies
>         >                             - Sustainability
>         >                             - Appropriate technology
>         >                             - Collaboration for practical
>         solutions
>         >
>         >         Founding director, Appropedia Foundation, 501(c)(3)
>         >
>         >         Buy online through http://appropedia.maatiam.com
>         (Amazon, eBay
>         >         and more) and a percentage of your purchase goes to
>         Appropedia
>         >         - at no extra cost to you.
>         >
>         >         The economy is a wholly owned subsidiary of the
>         environment. -
>         >         Tim Wirth
>         >
>         >         _______________________________________________
>         >         cc-community mailing list
>         >         cc-community at lists.ibiblio.org
>         >
>         http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-community
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         >
>         > --
>         > --
>         > Rich Vázquez
>         > _______________________________________________
>         > cc-community mailing list
>         > cc-community at lists.ibiblio.org
>         > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-community
>         
>         --
>         Jon Phillips
>         jon at creativecommons.org
>         skype: kidproto (preferred phone)
>         im: kidproto
>         china phone: +86 1-360-282-8624
>         
>         Business + Community Manager
>         Creative Commons
>         www.creativecommons.org
>         
>         
>         Please note: the contents of this email are not intended to be
>         legal advice nor should they be relied upon as or represented
>         to be
>         legal advice.  Creative Commons cannot and does not give legal
>         advice.
>         You need to assess the suitability of Creative Commons' tools
>         for
>         your particular situation, which may include obtaining
>         appropriate
>         legal advice from a licensed attorney.
>         
>         
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>         
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Chris Watkins  (a.k.a. Chriswaterguy)
> 
> Founding admin at Appropedia.org, the wiki of:
>                     - International development
>                     - Anti-poverty strategies
>                     - Sustainability
>                     - Appropriate technology
>                     - Collaboration for practical solutions
> 
> Founding director, Appropedia Foundation, 501(c)(3)
> 
> Buy online through http://appropedia.maatiam.com (Amazon, eBay and
> more) and a percentage of your purchase goes to Appropedia - at no
> extra cost to you.
> 
> The economy is a wholly owned subsidiary of the environment. - Tim
> Wirth 
> _______________________________________________
> cc-community mailing list
> cc-community at lists.ibiblio.org
> http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/cc-community
-- 
Jon Phillips
jon at creativecommons.org
skype: kidproto (preferred phone)
im: kidproto
china phone: +86 1-360-282-8624

Business + Community Manager
Creative Commons
www.creativecommons.org


Please note: the contents of this email are not intended to be
legal advice nor should they be relied upon as or represented to be
legal advice.  Creative Commons cannot and does not give legal advice.
You need to assess the suitability of Creative Commons' tools for
your particular situation, which may include obtaining appropriate
legal advice from a licensed attorney.




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