[cc-community] Orlowski vs. liblicense
drew Roberts
zotz at 100jamz.com
Wed Aug 22 07:58:12 EDT 2007
On Wednesday 22 August 2007 07:38 am, Giorgos Cheliotis wrote:
> Thanks Nick,
>
> that is a very good comment about the actual value of the work and whether
> the fear of foregoing potential future revenues by using a more liberal
> license is exaggerated.
I think it is exagerated... but it is not. The thing is, it is sort fo like a
lottery, but with a really high ticket cost and a really poor payout
percentage.
As an artist, you might be better served to release your works by-sa and to
buy a lottery ticket for each work that you release under such a license.
Keep a spreadsheet with columns for work and lottery ticket and winnings.
And as a double-super-plus bonus, you may still be able to commercialy license
your original by-sa works under a dual license for a fee.
> I believe that more often than not it is, but I
> hope to get some data which will clearly show this. If anyone has any ideas
> on how to go about this, do let us know.
>
> Giorgos
all the best,
drew
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: cc-community-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org on behalf of Nick Sincaglia
> Sent: Tue 8/21/2007 10:05 PM
> To: cc-community at lists.ibiblio.org
> Subject: Re: [cc-community] Orlowski vs. liblicense
>
>
> I have been thinking about this article a lot in the past day because it is
> a familiar argument I hear it a lot. If you strip away all the anger, name
> calling and accusatory language, you are left with a perspective or opinion
> that differs from this community. I am not sure if there is really much
> that can be done to address the difference in opinion because neither side
> of the argument can really know the value of a piece on intellectual
> property a priori. Let me explain what I mean.
>
> There are many people in the established creative industries who on a daily
> basis work with creative people to maximize the commercial potential of
> their creative output. On a daily basis these people see the potential
> value that is created and sustained over time from a single work or
> collection of works. These people also see the abuses that occur in the
> business. Don't make the mistake in thinking that all organizations within
> the established creative industries work happily together. There are strong
> adversarial relationships that span many decades and a large amount of
> distrust between organizations.
>
> I will use the music publishing business as an example. The music
> publishers represent the song writers, not the recording artists. They have
> seen abuses of the people they represent by the record labels. They get
> particularly upset when they hear about song writers who sell the rights to
> their compositions to record labels for a lucrative recording contract.
> Particularly early in the song writer's career. They feel it is part of
> their job to help protect the song writer from under valuing their assets.
> They feel like it their job to educate and try and prevent the song writer
> from making decisions they may regret later on when they better understand
> the way the business works and where long term value is created.
>
> Now comes along the Creative Commons. The argument expressed in the
> Orlowski article comes from the same protective perspective. Except this
> time, instead of a lucrative recording contract, the benefits are even less
> tangible and more speculative.
>
> So the difference between the Orlowski view point and that of the commonist
> comes down to "What is the potential value of the creative work". From
> Orlowski's perspective, the value has high potential value in the future.
> He is concerned that the creator may make a decision that has lasting
> consequences to that value and he would like to protect the creator from
> giving up that value without some tangible benefits in doing so.
>
> The commonist perspective is very different. The commonist understands that
> the value of the network is based on the number of people in that network.
> The value that this creator can get from this network is significantly
> greater than the what they put into it.
>
> I think it all boils down to one thing. What is the future value of a
> creative work and to whom? I don't know how to answer this question to
> satisfy either side. I think both sides are going to have to agree to
> disagree. The only thing I think that can done to counter Orlowski's
> argument is to stress the benefits of a commons and provide the statistics
> on the likelihood that the creative work will be commercially successful.
>
> tbd
>
>
> On 8/21/07, Rob Myers <rob at robmyers.org> wrote:
>
> Kevin Driscoll wrote:
> > On 8/20/07, jonathon <jonathon.blake at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Including a document that is a crash course in IP rights would be a
> >> useful addition to that tool. (There are a number of fairly good essays
> >> that have CC-BY-SA licences that could be included as part of the
> >> documentation for that tool.)
> >
> > One must be very careful in creating a "crash course in IP" on the
> > OLPC. Could it not form a dangerous trojan horse to cultures with
> > different understandings of property?
>
> The book "Code" edited by Ghosh contains some very good essays about how
> TRIPS-style intellectual property interacts with tribal or traditional
> knowledge and culture.
>
> http://mitpress.mit.edu/catalog/item/default.asp?tid=10459&ttype=2
>
> The commons-law mailing list sometimes covers this kind of issue as well.
>
> http://mail.sarai.net/mailman/listinfo/commons-law
>
> Once kids start using OLPC they are dealing with intellectual property
> whether they like it or not so I do believe that they will need some
> education about it. I agree about the dangers of creating an IP
> maximalist trojan horse. It's important not to just do WIPO's work for
> them. So any crash course should be a *critical* crash course,
> presenting the issues and allowing people to take a critical stance to
> IP if they wish.
>
> But then the Orlowskis of this world will complain about CC propaganda.
> ;-)
>
> - Rob.
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(da idea man)
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