[B-Greek] Verbal Genitive 1 Peter 1:2
Norman Wood
nandk.wood at blueyonder.co.uk
Thu Dec 4 16:41:42 EST 2008
Hi Carl,
Thank you to both yourself and George for your replies.
This Greek sometimes seems like one step forward two steps back. I'll have
to think about this one a bit more I see.
Best Wishes
Norman Wood
Scotland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl Conrad" <cwconrad2 at mac.com>
To: "Norman Wood" <nandk.wood at blueyonder.co.uk>
Cc: <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 11:44 AM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Verbal Genitive 1 Peter 1:2
>
> On Dec 4, 2008, at 6:21 AM, Norman Wood wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> In 1 Peter 1:2 the phrase EN hAGIASMWi PNEUMATOS is described by J.
>> Ramsey Michaels as a subjective genitive (WBC pg 11). However he renders
>> it 'consecrated by the Spirit'. This makes ' by the Spirit' an adverbial
>> phrase and the Spirit is then not the subject of the verb consecrate. Am
>> I right in thinking that 'what the spirit consecrates' is how a
>> subjective genitive in this case might be rendered?
>>
>> Also how does one determine the tense of the verb in a verbal genitive?
>> In the rendering 'consecrated by the Spirit' hAGIAZW has been rendered
>> as a past tense, however the examples in Wallace GGBB pg 114 translate
>> as both past and present . Are there any guidelines for this?
>
> It seems to me that you're confusing the English grammar of the phrase as
> translated ("consecrated by the Spirit") with the Greek grammar of the
> phrase in the reek text (EN hAGIASMWi PNEUMATOS). This English phrase
> consists of a passive participle followed by a prepositional phrase
> indicating the agent performing the consecration. I think that What
> Michaels probably means is that hAGIASMOS is a verbal noun and that the
> genitive PNEUMATOS indicates the performer of the action referred to by
> the verbal noun.
>
> The way the term "subjective genitive" has more or less traditionally
> been understood is that a genitive substantive indicates the performer of
> the action referred to by the verbal noun, while an "objective genitive"
> indicates the recipient of that action. If PNEUMATOS in the above phrase
> were to be understood as an "OBJECTIVE genitive," the sense would in that
> case be that the Spirit is what is being or has been consecrated.
>
> In fact there is no single right way to English the Greek phrase; one
> might just as well have Englished it as "by consecration by the Spirit"
> or "by the Spirit's consecration."
>
> Carl W. Conrad
> Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
>
>
>
>
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