[B-Greek] Jn 12:44
webb at selftest.net
Thu Nov 17 14:19:34 EST 2005
I had another thought about Jn 12:44 and NIV, and that is that NIV
translators chose the general formulation:
When a man believes in me, he does not believe in me, but in the one who
Taken by themselves in English, the words, "he does not believe in
me, but in the one who sent me", seem to say that the person doesn't believe
in Jesus. Jesus' following statement, which parallels this statement (hO
QEWRWN EME QEWREI TON PEMYANTA ME), clearly does not admit of the
understanding that the person doesn't see Jesus. To see me, says Jesus, is
to see the one who sent me (at the same time, and in the process of seeing
Notice that a slight change in the English phraseology might solve
the problem of unwanted ambiguity that NIV translators solve by inserting
"only", but without requiring that expedient.
And Jesus shouted out and said, "When a person believes in me, they're not
believing in me but in the one who sent me, and the person who sees me sees
the one who sent me."
The paradox remains, but the ambiguity of a flat contradiction seems to be
Speaking of making translations based on conceptual or theological bases,
another thread was talking about Jn 8:44: hOTAN LALHi TO YEUDOS, EK TWN
IDIWN LALEI, hOTI YEUSTHS ESTIN KAI hO PATHR AUTOU.
Just taking the Greek by itself, it looks as though Jesus is saying,
"...because he is a liar, and so is his father". In fact, that is how
Lattimore, the expert translator of the Greek classics (and later works from
the period of the NT and beyond too) translates the verse. He doesn't have
the same theological lens as most translators, and so he doesn't conclude,
"Well, we don't have any information from anywhere else in scripture that
the Devil has a father, so he can't be saying that". But notice what this
opens up. How can anything surprising to us (as translators) ever get *into*
scripture, if we stop it at the door on the basis of assumptions about what
it is possible for the scripture to say? It's a humbling question.
From: b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Scott Wells
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2005 12:43 PM
Subject: [B-Greek] Jn 12:44
IHSOUS DE EKRAXEN KAI EIPEN hO PISTEUWN EIS EME OU PISTEUEI EIS ALLA EIS TON
PEMYANTA ME John 12:44
The NIV inserts "only" in their rendering of this text (Then Jesus cried
out, "When a man believes in me, he does not believe in me only, but in the
one who sent me.). I can see why one might want to do this for theological
reasons, but I don't see any textual justification for it. Is this a
legitimate way of rendering the text?
scott.alton.wells at us.army.mil
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.3/173 - Release Date: 11/16/2005
B-Greek home page: http://metalab.unc.edu/bgreek
B-Greek mailing list
B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
More information about the B-Greek